Upcoming competition for Empeg

Long time reader, first time poster.

Ars Technica alerted me to Gocho Network's E-1337 player due out in June. It will have the functionality of the Empeg and then some. Supports wireless Eternet AND GPS out of the box. Will use PDAs for the user interface - a major limiter but I am OK because I just got my Prisim. Runs Linux. Has budget box like specs, i.e. 600Mhz+ CPU, 128MB RAM, 80-100GB hard drive.

I really like these specs. I know the StrongARM is nothing to sneeze at, but a 600MHZ processor allows for a world of possibilities. In an Ars forum, a company founder says it will decode MPEG-4 video/audio. He contends there will be real-time weater/traffic/news upon request. Same person says a sister company to Rio has seen the logo, which looks strikingly similar to Rio's and has said nothing. Could this sister company be Empeg?

Now one of the original draws of the Empeg was the geek appeal. I don't think we have many using their Empeg's for crunching Seti@Home or distributed.net blocks and transfering the the info to their computers using Apple's Airport.

Gocho plans on making the box at near-cost and making the serious money off subscriptions. Looks like it will beat sattelite radio to the punch by some time. Then again, the competing sattelite providers have inked major partnership deals (both content and automakers).

Also interesting is this division of services they call "Virtual Radio," "Virtual Changer," and the "MP3 Library."

There is a lot to like and a lot to question. Anyone near Austin mind peeking in these Gocho's windows for me and checking up on their progress?

As Ars would say - supra-geek-cool.

Interesting, but I don't see it as very threatening atm; the spec of the box (using 3.5" drives - when will people learn?!) even at cost is going to me more than $800, including the GPS, CDPD, 802.11, etc etc.

The StrongARM can decode MPEG4 video/audio. Seen packetnetworks stuff recently, running on the iPAQ?

Satellite radio has rather a lot of marketing behind it, plus the fact it'll be available in the same timeframe as this box, will cost the same on subscription, and isn't limited by cellphone coverage. I don't think people will want to pay $120 for XM or Sirius, personally, but they have enough partners to shove it pretty much down most car buyer's throats.

...and don't think we've not got anything planned :)

Hugo

Using 3.5 drives is the only way to get the capacities they are talking about. Other Do It Yourselfers have used these with some success. Did the first pre-Empeg start with 3.5 drives? With a trunk unit, expanding to a second drive is a cinch. It will be some time before the market releases an affordable 200GB laptop-size drive.

People can get 80GB hard drives in single quantities for $243 USD. This is better than paying $560 for a 20GB drive. I doubt they will install the drive though.

I am curious to see what content partners Empeg has lined up. I would like to see AudioBasket. They are actively recruiting partners...

While I am very aware of the power/importance of marketing, I am keenly interested in who has the better technology. Empeg survived/thrived long enough to be acquired. With SonicBlue in hyper acquisition mode, could Gocho be a worthwhile addition?

Interesting, indeed. I'm bit dubious, though, that this thing will be any good at any of the many things it claims to do. Here is why:

1. Integrated GPS. Good idea, navigation systems are really catching on. Will it compare to the better models on the market? Voice prompts? Detailed maps? Nice interface? I somehow doubt they can beat the dedicated systems at a fraction of the cost.

2. Subscription radio. Completely ignoring the cost factor, are they sure they can produce better radio than all the other stations out there? There's only one station in my area that I sort of like, what are the chances that theirs will be the second?

3. Wireless connectivity on the road. Sure, you can do it, I even remember something a while ago about 16 cell phones working in parallel to provide a broadband connection. It'll cost an arm and a leg, though.

4. PDA for the user interface. Yeah, right. On-screen buttons too, very useful while driving. The screens of these things are not exactly large either.

5. It runs Linux. Great... but can you telnet to it? Can you get a shell prompt? My guess is no, you can't. The reason is the subscription business model. If they make these things hacker-friendly, people will circumvent the subscription functions in no time. So they have to keep the platform closed and thus vastly reduce its hacker appeal. Just look at Tivo and you'll know what I mean. (Disclaimer: I don't own a Tivo, this is my impression from various things I've read about it.)

Then again this thing might be the coolest thing ever created, we'll just have to wait and see.

Borislav

$560 for a 20GB

a 2,5" 20 GB drive is not THAT expensive! It's about $250. But it's a shame the 30GB is about $600!!
I remember I've read something about a 40GB or even 50GB 2,5" drive but I never saw one in some pricelist.. I hope they're coming soon.

Generally it seems as if the development of bigger 2,5" drives is a bit stuck.


TeeMcBee
Got my Mk2! # 080000143

In reply to:

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Ars Technica alerted me to Gocho Network's E-1337 player due out in June.

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E-1337????
E1337
Sounds like somebody might be having some fun with Hackerz lingo.

#170... I got SN: 080000101 12 gig Blue!

SFSpinDr, I'm not sure if you noticed why Hugo was negative about the 3.5" drives.

Using 3.5 drives is the only way to get the capacities they are talking about. Other Do It Yourselfers have used these with some success.

I haven't heard that. I've heard about alot of crashing discs when potholes and speed bumps are thrown into the mix.

With a trunk unit, expanding to a second drive is a cinch.

But why would you want to? Screw PC cases in the trunk. I sure wouldn't feel very secure with two 3.5" HDD's bolted to an unmoving, steel frame in my trunk. But I'm sure this thing will attempt to solve that somehow. If it doesn't, they'll have alot of unhappy customers.

It will be some time before the market releases an affordable 200GB laptop-size drive.

Yeah, but in the mean-time you've already replaced your 3.5" drive several times.

I sure don't know about this new player. I still wouldn't like to have the player in the trunk, and you have to pick up your damn Palm device every time you want to do something (that can be dangerous).

Oh well, sorry for venting.

DiGNAN

Oh man, E-1337, that's just about the lamest thing i've seen in a long time. Hackerspeak for a product name. ick. I have no idea about the product...but damn...that's some funny shite that they chose that name.


|| loren.cox || 080000446 ||

Err, no - we never used 3.5" drives. Even my mp3mobile, which I built for my pleasure only used a 2.5" drive.

I doubt SB would be interested in a company with a tenuous grip on hardware (ie: stick a whole PC in the car, 3.5" drives & all) and as yet totally unproven software. Obviously, I can't speak for them, but it doesn't look anything like a product yet...

Hugo

tihs is gona be awesome. its gona totaly kick ass!!!!! its so 1337 theyll sell ten x as meny as empeg.

Rex

teemcbee:

I was referring to the price SB charges for upgrading the Empeg.

Edited by SFSpinDr on 06/02/01 08:25 PM.

Rio haven't announced pricing for the 30/60Gb players yet, let alone the upgrade price.

Rob

Greetings!

Is Rio still working on the empeg site? Any target date for when they will launch it?

Paul G.
SN# 090000587 (40GB Green)

It is being held back until the product is available from the Rio store, which should be soon.

Rob

Hey, I'm hoping that it's appropriate for me to post here. If not, let me know and I'll buzz off... :)

My name is Eric Smith, and I'm the founder of Gocho Networks, and the inventor of the Gocho system.

I wanted to clarify some issues regarding what we're doing with Gocho.

First of all, “E-1337” is a code name. :) We’ve got an office full of Linux programmers, and we like to have fun with this kind of stuff. It was meant as a joke.

We’ll eventually name it something sanitized and corporate and trademark-friendly, but for now, we call it the Elite. :) Please don’t hold my sense of humor against our product! :)

Second, Gocho is not a hardware company. We're a software and network services company. We layer our application software on top of existing mobile systems to create what we call a mobile media server-- or transit computer. The combination is an appliance, not some Win98 clone box with a power inverter strapped into your trunk… (Apologies to G-NET Canada, et. al.)

We don't design the hardware.

That said, the hardware that we'll layer the Gocho application services on top of is a ruggedized, custom PC system. It's not delivered in a PC form factor, however. It will look to the end user very much like a CD changer. The HD's used are 3.5" form factor, but they are capable of surviving and thriving in a mobile environment, due to thermal and shock modifications done to the system.

We utilize PDA's as controllers for one principle reason-- we feel strongly that MOST users do not want to replace their existing head unit. Obviously, most of the folks here are fans of EMPEG (and rightly so, it’s a great system!)—and many of you have already purchased EMPEG and made modifications to your vehicles.

As a secondary consideration, we feel that the UI for in-dash/limited LCD systems such as EMPEG are not suitable to our applications-- which, surprisingly perhaps, only being with being an MP3 player. Our navigation and control systems are much more elegant than those we’ve found on existing in-dash systems.

Gocho will not be suitable for everyone, to be sure. If you don't already own a PDA, you may have some reservations about investing in one just to control your media. But we're confident that our product will fair well in the market place, and that it will provide significant value to our users.

Our mission, in the long run, is to grow the market of digital music consumers by creating a system which is simple, seamless to integrate, and -- most importantly-- one which doesn't require active management.

If you have any additional questions, please let me know. I’ll do the best I can to answer them.

Thanks for your time!

Sincerely,


C. Eric Smith
President/CEO
Gocho Networks, Inc.
www.gocho.net

(512) 478-8946 (Office)

Hey, I'm hoping that it's appropriate for me to post here. If not, let me know and I'll buzz off... :) My name is Eric Smith, and I'm the founder of Gocho Networks, and the inventor of the Gocho system.

Hey, there. It's cool to see you coming in here to defend your product. We definitely won't tell you to buzz off.

But with this BBS, it's kind of like having Linus Torvalds show up on the Microsoft campus to sing the praises of Linux. We'll try not to tear you apart too hard.

I'm interested in the thermal and shock modifications you're (they're?)doing to let a 3.5" drive survive in the car. Can you give us more details?

___________
Tony Fabris

Thanks for the welcome! :)

RE: Thermal/shock modifications...

I can't go into a tremendous amount of detail.

Here's what I can say:

It's a custom enclosure. It's got passive shock dampening.

It has active (and predictive) temp. regulation based on environmental variables. It utilizes "significant thermal mass" to help control the storage and release of thermal energy.

It is resistant to humidity and environmental pollution, because it doesn't rely on air circulation directly for cooling/heating.

The drives we're looking at using are extremely resistant to shock/vibe, as well as torsion warping/gyroscopic effects.

This is about as much as I can go into. More than this can't be said until a few more patents are in process.

Sorry for the lame legal cop-out. :(

In regards to being torn apart...

I think Empeg is a wonderful product! I really do! I think it's the best thing that's out there right now, certainly. I hope that those of you who already own and enjoy Empeg will consider adding Gocho to your car as well... we can co-exist together! :)

Take care!



C. Eric Smith
President/CEO
Gocho Networks, Inc.
www.gocho.net

(512) 478-8946 (Office)

In reply to:

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We utilize PDA's as controllers for one principle reason

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Interesting idea, but do you have the legal department to back it up? empeg disabled visuals on startup while in the car to avoid legal problems due to being distracting, and your system will be controlled by a PDA? I have a very hard time controlling a PDA well with one hand, and not knowing what is on the screen requires me to look.

I'm interested in your product, but I'm just hoping you realise you have a major legal issue developing when certain places are looking to ban cell phone use unless a hands free setup is used...

Hi,

Someone enlighten me?

In reply to:

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E-1337????
E1337
Sounds like somebody might be having some fun with Hackerz lingo.

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Errr?


_________________________________________
John, (MK1 #114-20G, MK2 #15-36G).

It's just the way script kiddies and wanna-be's type on the internet. Doing things like dEliBeRaTelY MiXInG cASE, or using numb3rs 7o r3p1ac3 l3tters. (3=E, 7=T, 1=L, etc.)

A lot of hackers and script kiddies like to use the term "Elite", often shortened to "Leet". So E-1337 is a pun on the word "Elite" written in script kiddie lingo.

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Tony Fabris

A lot of hackers and script kiddies like to use the term "Elite", often shortened to "Leet". So E-1337 is a pun on the word "Elite" written in script kiddie lingo.

Of course, the answer as to why is still a little vague

DiGNAN
Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da, etc.

Yeah, in my day we just replaced f's with ph's and everyone was happy.

Rob

ROFL!

I remember those days. Good to know it wasn't just the US.

I still say things like "Have phun" in e-mail messages.

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Tony Fabris

Ahh, I also remeber the days of hitting the phourms to chat and such :-)

I suppose the group Phish liked the idea as well...

(Wow, I'm begining to feel old when my ways seen to have disappeared. Not many of the new "script-kiddies" have even logged onto a real BBS, when it was a major part of my life a few years back.)

Totally OT!!

I suppose the group Phish liked the idea as well...

fish=ghoti

phoenetically it works. where from

____________________
Murray 06000047