Anybody used VNC to get onto the empeg yet? It would seem to have some interesting possibilities.

-Zeke

just say you weren't paying much attention...

I think frank had something like that going.

Sean

80000078

Correct; The VNC X-server runs smoothly on the empeg (if you shut down the player app). The only drawback is the lack of support for domain-sockets in the standard kernel. This means you cannot access the X-server from the empeg as display :0, you can only use TCP-sockets, so the displayname would be : [IP-ADDRESS]:0. This has some drawbacks using XDMCP icw access-control
To run it, you should install the base debian X-packages and of course the VNC-packages

Frank van Gestel

Of course, what would be *really* fun is a vnc-server which returns a picture of the empeg front, with updated area for the screen and click-trapping for the buttons in the picture - that way, you could connect to the empeg with anything which has a VNC client, even palmpilots...

Hugo

That was my initial plan when developing displayserver, write a VNC-server which serves the display. There are some examples of a simple server on the VNC-site. I cannot remember exactly why I switched to the java approach. I will look through some old code why it didn't work... I was probably just lazy...

Frank van Gestel

Hugo,
Gee that sounds like Displayserver! ;-) What I was driving at was how to get command line access over the network so the serial cable wouldn't be needed. I know telnet does this just fine, but a wee gui would be neat for file management from CE devices as typing on these things can be a chore. Any tiny X-Windows configured would have at least that.

As far as using a Palm/CE I figure that Jemplode & serial or wireless would be the way to go (ie Jemplode & serial in the car for guests to configure playlists), but this couldn't give command line access without a serial adapter & a terminal emulator program, whereas VNC could do the command line/file management stuff over the network.

-Zeke

just say you weren't paying much attention...

Yep, I was lazy. After reading the protocol-specification and experimenting with different pixelformats for a few days, I gave up.

Frank van Gestel

Yep, I was lazy. After reading the protocol-specification and experimenting with different pixelformats for a few days, I gave up.

Ahh, that explains why it's such a pain for me to get the iPaq to work with Displayserver in WinCE. There always has to be a difficult part in any process :-)

(I still don't have a way of getting Java on the iPaq that can access the network. A plugin of some type should be possible in Pocket IE, since Flash does this...)

No Java on Ipaq? Wow. I almost figured it had to be there. Interesting.

After a bit of looking I found this http://www.nsicom.com/products/eval1.asp. I'm not a programmer, but it was the only thing I saw that claimed to allow Java on a CE 3.0 device. However, I don't believe this will help PIE at all, from what I've read. I guess this is another reason to lean towards putting Linux on the Ipaq! Now if only I had one...darn wait list for the 3670.

-Zeke

just say you weren't paying much attention...

http://www.pocketlinux.org

pure java gui :-)

http://www.pocketlinux.org

pure java gui :-)

Yep, PocketLinux was nice, but I still like being able to turn off the unit from time to time without a serial terminal with me all the time. Linux on the iPaq has a ways to go before it can replace WinCE as a useable PDA and Pocket PC OS.

(I tried every distribution of Linux I could find except the one made by the QT folks. It seemed the more adnavced the GUI was, the worse it was for supporting basic PDA features like sleep mode. And discussion at handhelds.org right now indicates the existing power managment they have comes nowhere close to WinCE on the device.)

No Java on Ipaq? Wow. I almost figured it had to be there. Interesting.

Nope. The HP palmtop one has it (the clamshell) along with some other nice things, but MS decided to skimp on features for CE 3 on a palm sized unit even though the iPaq has the same processor and memory as the HP.

I'll try that link you provided to see if it's any better then the few other solutions I have found. My PCMCIA nic is at home so I can't test it yet, but it's a huge memory hog. I had to practicially remove all other programs. Not a good solution.

I'll be very interested in your results. No Java is a real killer for the Ipaq as wireless displayserver remote/in car emplode platform thoughts. There's not even a VNC compiled for CE 3.0 (only 2.1 betas) on the http://www.uk.research.att.com/vnc site, but nothing for the Arm as of yet. That's too bad as this would be great for umpteen different home network tricks.

Frank, if you're following this, how hard would a more static, pure html control page be to implement into Displayserver (for home networked use)? No moving graphics just now & next screen & controls that refreshed say every 10 seconds? If d.s. controls didn't use a java app, this could alleviate a tough situation for the Ipaq set (sheesh, listen to me! I don't even _have_ one yet).

Regarding the in-car emplode (just for playlist creation), can standard win32 apps run at all in CE? My guess is no. I suppose one could use the CE media player to stream off the empeg then loop the headphone outs to the aux in on the empeg, although this seems a really convoluted way to allow playlist creation in the car (beyond the somewhat limited search/append we have in 1.02). Perhaps 1.1 might make in-car playlist generation simpler? I have no idea.

Aaagh, that pesky reality stuff getting in the way of my George Jetson wishes...I know it will happen. Imagining Iowa...if you build it...

-Zeke

just say you weren't paying much attention...

Edited by Ezekiel on 27/04/01 04:53 AM.

Well, VNC should be easy. They have the WinCE spurce right there, so once I get a decent internet connection, I should be able to download the 300 some meg CE compiler suite from MS and compile it. Or theres this http://conduits.com/ce/apps/vnc.asp. It's compiled for the ARM already, just seems to be more for the HP unit.

And the Java client looked promising, but no integration with IE. There has to be some way of doing this, since Macromedia got Flash in there. I'm just hoping CE 4 will be a bit better about returning the PocketPC to a Pocket PC and not an amazingly fast product to compete with Palms on the PDA front. (/me also hopes CE 4 will fit into the 16 mb ROM, it should with all the empty space CE 3 leaves in there)

Is the HP Journada an ARM unit? I didn't think it was according to this http://www.microsoft.com/mobile/pocketpc/bguide/hpj_specs.asp. I was looking at the conduits site last night too. My question is how portable are the apps across different processors under CE? I have to think they'd be portable, otherwise how could CE gain much programming momentum?

I've got a fast connection and can burn & mail a CD if you would like. Just send me a private note with the mail details & the link to what you need (the limit of my compiling experiece is 'hello, world').

With VNC into a VNC server on the ipaq a program to generate the IR commands should be pretty straightforward, especially in a wee X-windows session (I might even be able to attempt something simple).

I have to wonder the future of Java in CE since the Sun/MS settlement http://www.microsoft.com/PressPass/press/2001/Jan01/01-23SunPR.asp. It would seem to be none. So unless a second party releases a Java enabled CE mini-browser (maybe Opera might) it doesn't look good.

It'll be interesting to see which way MS takes CE in the next few years. If history is any guide, small and fast will not be the direction.

-Zeke


just say you weren't paying much attention...

This is the HP Jornada 700 that I am referring to above. As far as portibility, nothing exists for just copying a program from one CE device of one CPU type to another. For authors, it's fairly easy as all that is needed is a recompile. Just some of the pains of having 4 popular processors on the WinCE side.

I should have a better connection here in the next few days. Most of my problems are due to where I live, and I've been told by the ISP that where I am moving to should be better.

Aah. That's a horse of a different color. I've got the CE developer's suite almost downloaded (hey, why not). It was a pain to go through the sign up/nosy questioning. I can stash it on an ftp site for a few days if you want to get it that way, or send me an ftp site when you get situated and I can u/l to you.

-Z

just say you weren't paying much attention...

Drakino,
I found this today http://www.microsoft.com/mobile/pocketpc/downloads/powertoys.asp. It says "Microsoft Internet Explorer Tools for Pocket PCs
This Power Toy allows you to adjust Internet Explorer settings on your Pocket PC. You can enable/disable Javascript support, as well as changing the amount of storage available for temporary Internet files. "

I got my Ipaq yesterday and the wireless gateway & Orinoco card should arrive tomorrow & the PCMCIA sleeve on Friday. Hopefully I'll have some encouraging results to share this weekend.

-Zeke

just say you weren't paying much attention...

You can enable/disable Javascript support, as well as changing the amount of storage available for temporary Internet files.

Still dosen't help the current situation, as the DisplayServer uses Java and not JavaScript (/me throws a few more choice words towards Netscape for naming it that).

Definitly keep us posted if you find anything though.

Oh, and what iPaq are you getting?

DisplayServer uses Java and not JavaScript (/me throws a few more choice words towards Netscape for naming it that).

Well, tell you what, why don't we just start calling Javascript by another name, and maybe it will stick?

Personally, I've been calling it "The Devil's Own Language" for quite a while now...

___________
Tony Fabris

It was originally called LiveScript until someone had a bright idea.


__
Unit serial number 47 (was 330 in the queue)...

Drat. I was so excited. Thanks for pointing me up on this. Saved me some downloading tomorrow. I'll just have to do it the convoluted way: Displayserver --> Winamp (on PC) --> VNC on Ipaq to control Winamp --> lineout to stereo.

just say you weren't paying much attention...

Well, I've done it. Wireless control of empeg via Ipaq VNC & a host PC. Not as elegant as displayserver onto the ipaq (I think this can be done...), but enough for this weekend. I'll post more details tomorrow, but here's a pic of my Ipaq display showing the VNC session to the host PC with displayserver running. Off to bed now...

-Zeke

just say you weren't paying much attention...

Would be interested to hear more Zake. I already have displayserver, Orinoco g/w and PCMCIA cards at home. Just picked up a iPAQ, so am looking for things to do with the iPAQ.

- --
Rod, UK Mk2 64gig Red S/No.341

hello,

I got it work with the Pocket Explorer from my wireless IPaq to access the displayserver. There is a JeodeRuntime Java VM from Handango available for US 20. If you use an Airport with WEP and the Orinoco PC-Card download this driver:

ftp.orinocowireless.com/pub/software/ORiNOCO/PC_Card/win_ce/R7.0spring2001/CE_3.0_pocket

Have a look on my attachement!

Bye

CrazyMelki

Cheers, will add that to my list of things to do

- --
Rod, UK Mk2 64gig Red S/No.341 2xDell RioReceiver

Yeehaa! I just wasn't patient enough waiting for the applet to load. Killer. You made me a very happy person. By the way Jimmysoft landscape & Ipaqclk (overclocker for Ipaq) are excellent additions to running displayserver. Landscape makes it possible to see 100% of the empeg graphic and Ipaqclk speeds it up considerably (especially the visuals). Both can be found at Hangango.

-Zeke

just say you weren't paying much attention...

Edited by Ezekiel on 07/08/01 04:53 AM.

Glad to know this works now. I lost my PCMCIA and CF sleeves for the iPaq, so I haven't been able to test it on my iPaq. Glad I have another reason to have then turn up again though.

I am going crazy now!

Do you know about the Remote Display Control for the PocketPC?

If not you will find the information here
http://www.microsoft.com/mobile/pocketpc/stepbystep/remotedisplay.asp

Now you can control your PocketPC via your Windows Workstation! And the Pocket PC ist connected to your Empeg via WL-LAN to the Displayserver....This is almost a never ending story...

Have anybody a bigger pic from the displayserver? ;-)

bye CrazyMelki

CrazyMelki