#266477 - 30/09/2005 19:10
Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 15/08/2000
Posts: 4859
Loc: New Jersey, USA
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Since this thread hasn't been posted yet... 
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Paul Grzelak
200GB with 48MB RAM, Illuminated Buttons and Digital Outputs
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#266478 - 30/09/2005 19:59
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: pgrzelak]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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Someone pointed out that the plot was a metaphor for trying to get a cult show shown on network TV. Discuss.
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Bitt Faulk
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#266479 - 30/09/2005 23:49
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: wfaulk]
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addict
Registered: 01/03/2002
Posts: 599
Loc: Florida
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I just got back and enjoyed the movie a lot, but I've watched all the episodes on AIR, ON DVD 3 times and read the 3 comics. Anyone that didn't see the Firefly series go? I would really like to know what you thought.
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#266480 - 01/10/2005 01:14
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: Attack]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 25/08/2000
Posts: 2413
Loc: NH USA
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I've not seen it but the NY Times seems to like it a lot: 4 1/2 of 5 stars. Quote:
It probably isn't fair to Joss Whedon's "Serenity" to say that this unassuming science-fiction adventure is superior in almost every respect to George Lucas's aggressively more ambitious "Star Wars: Episode III - Revenge of the Sith." But who cares about fair when there is fun to be had? Scene for scene, "Serenity" is more engaging and certainly better written and acted than any of Mr. Lucas's recent screen entertainments. Mr. Whedon isn't aiming to conquer the pop-culture universe with a branded mythology; he just wants us to hitch a ride to a galaxy far, far away and have a good time. The journey is the message, not him.
-Zeke
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#266481 - 01/10/2005 01:29
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: Ezekiel]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 30/04/2000
Posts: 3810
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I'm hoping to go tomorrow night. Sitting at home working tonight...
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#266482 - 01/10/2005 05:32
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: Attack]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31602
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
Anyone that didn't see the Firefly series go?
I grilled the one virgin member of our group about it. She enjoyed it, but felt the characters were a bit flat and not well-realized. I can only assume that's because she doesn't know all their backstory the way we fans do.
Other things she didn't pick up on, because they were covered very subtly and very quickly with subversive exposition:
- The fact that Inara was a former crew member who left Serenity because of the unresolved romantic tension with Mal.
- Inara's actual profession.
Which, honestly, were not necessary to the plot.
As for me: This being my second viewing, I picked up on a lot of new things. Most interesting to me was Mal and Zoe's final conversation (exact words approximate):
Mal: So how is she holding together?
Zoe: She's torn up, but she'll fly true.
Mal: It's gonna be a bumpy ride.
Zoe: Always is.
The conversation seemed overly melodramatic, over-acted, with too much dramatic pause and too much swooping-camera stuff. Not to mention that the conversation would have been better spoken with Kaylee. Until, of course, you realize they're not really talking about Serenity at all.
Joss Whedon is my master now.
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#266483 - 01/10/2005 15:32
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: tfabris]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
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This review was not so positive. It's the first negative reaction I've heard though, including non-fans of the series. But this reviewer seemed pretty against the whole concept of the show to begin with, so I suppose there's no helping that. Most of the complaints are either with the idea of the show or that some of the characters didn't get developed as well as they could have (which is a given, being that you have a large cast). And her last statement about Firefly deserving to be canceled is just inflamitory to all the many fans who love the show and bought the DVD. Unfortunatly, both my wife and I have gotten pretty sick and are not well enough to go to the theater. Which really stinks because we are both totally psyched about the movie (my wife triend to convince me to take her to see it last night, even though she can barely walk she's feeling so bad), especially after hearing such great feedback (reel.com notwithstanding). So hopefully we'll be seeing it sometime this week after we're feeling better.
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-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
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#266484 - 02/10/2005 03:14
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: JeffS]
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old hand
Registered: 28/12/2001
Posts: 868
Loc: Los Angeles
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Let me say I am a huge fan of the series. I watched them all again in the run-up to see the movie and loved them still.
I hated the movie. I almost walked out. Dreary, dark, depressing, and humorless. It fails on almost every level; the dialogue was terrible and the banter was flat, the chemistry didn't work at all for some reason, the characters were inconsistant, the stylized camera work that worked on TV become just annoying on the big screen, and the plot was too contrived. There were good parts, but I haven't been this disappointed in a movie in years, perhaps ever.
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#266485 - 02/10/2005 03:33
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: JeffS]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/12/2000
Posts: 2665
Loc: Manteca, California
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I'm just back from seeing it. The 7:20pm Sat. show. Sad that attendance was truly poor.
The continuity with the series had some gaps, but it think it served to let you know some time had passed between the series end, and this story.
Some parts were predictable, others, not so much.
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Glenn
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#266486 - 02/10/2005 04:34
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: ninti]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 31/08/1999
Posts: 1649
Loc: San Carlos, CA
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Quote:
I hated the movie.
Really? I was a fan of the series as well I just got back from the movie and really enjoyed it. The pacing was a bit different than the show since they had to fit a whole storyline into a couple hours, but I thought it was well done. There was enough backstory that the person I was with understood what was going on despite not having watched the series. She seemed to really enjoy it although I didn't test her on it like Tony apparently did with his group 
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I haven't been this disappointed in a movie in years, perhaps ever.
Have you seen Hitchhikers Guide? That was my disappointment for the year.
Anyway, two thumbs up over here.
-Mike
Edited by mcomb (02/10/2005 04:40)
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#266487 - 02/10/2005 05:44
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: mcomb]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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I'm somewhere inbetween. I thought it was a pretty good movie, but wasn't really all that good as a Firefly movie. The only character that really needed to be there was River, and several of them were just window-dressing. Book and Inara were barely there at all and the rest other than Mal and Simon just had a few lines here and there. And given that Simon's plotline was tied up as much as River's, he was given relatively little screen time. Anyway, the thing that made Firefly great was the character interaction, and we got so little of that as to be nonexistant. Then again, it's hard to have character interaction when most of them are barely there. And then the other characters whose storylines were closed, too, just felt heavyhanded and pointless. I get that that's how things go sometimes, and wouldn't have been out of place in the TV show, but it didn't really seem to fit the movie.
On the other hand, I liked the plot. It was pretty good, even if it felt more like Star Trek than Firefly usually did. I think that the way they wrapped up the River storyline with it was a little abrupt. (Why did the revelation affect her in that way, for instance?) But there was some good foreshadowing with the (to us) incidental portion of that storyline that I thought worked quite well.
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Bitt Faulk
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#266488 - 02/10/2005 15:45
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: wfaulk]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 31/08/1999
Posts: 1649
Loc: San Carlos, CA
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Quote:
And then the other characters whose storylines were closed, too, just felt heavyhanded and pointless.
That I agree with and was a point I intended to make in my post, but forgot to. Book in particular obviously had a story that I'm disappointed they never really revealed. Was his story in the comic books or something?
-Mike
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#266489 - 02/10/2005 20:53
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: mcomb]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
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I just saw the movie- I thought it was awesome. I can't wait to see it again. And I think it was much more fun than the newest Star Wars movies. Much more in the spirit of the first three. Time to get this T-Shirt! [big spoilers] I'll agree that it is dissapointing that some of the characters were killed off without telling their stories, Book especially, but I blame Fox for that. Imagine how much better this would have been if the story could have been developed over four seasons like Joss origionally planned. As for killing off characters, I think Joss did what he needed to to make a great story, and as much as I hated to see Wash go (he was one of my favorites), it definitely heightened the intensity of the following scenes and made them much stronger. There was a very real sense of desperation in the characters and both my wife and I were on the edge of our chairs. And the River was awesome- it was fun seeing her finally let loose. [/big spoilers] I think at this point that it would be hard to bring Firefly back as a TV show, though I could see more movies being made. It would be nice if I were wrong, though. I'd love to have some more episodes to add to our collection.
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-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
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#266490 - 02/10/2005 21:05
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: wfaulk]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
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Quote:
Anyway, the thing that made Firefly great was the character interaction, and we got so little of that as to be nonexistant.
Unfortunately, I think that's the nature of the beast. The character interaction that made Firefly great worked because those interactions had time to develop- that kind of time simply isn't available in a movie. I remember reading and interview with JW where he stated that he made the concious decision to focus on only a few characters in order to make it work as a movie.
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On the other hand, I liked the plot.
Me too- I hadn't really thought that the Reavers were anything more than space boogey-men. That their existence was important suprised me- in a good way. It seems a lot of the reviews are assulting the plot of the movie as being done-before sci-fi. It didn't really strike me that way, but I'm not very sophisticated when it comes to that kind of thing. It seemed like a good plot that fit these characters and it was fun to watch.
And I thought the bad guy was very well done. He definitely was more than just a flat-out villan. It was nice that they chose something other than an evil archtype.
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I think that the way they wrapped up the River storyline with it was a little abrupt.
I agree it would have been better the way it was origionally intended, developed over time. But once again I blame Fox for this. It's nice to have some kind of resolution.
Quote:
Why did the revelation affect her in that way, for instance?
I think the idea was that what she knew was tormenting her because in one way she was "owned" by the government and yet she was trying to be her own free agent. Once she was able to expose the truth to the others, there was no longer a conflict because she was no longer holding the truth inside. Or at least something like that- I think it's supposed to be a little ambigugous, but definitely there was the concept of inner conflict being resolved.
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-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
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#266492 - 03/10/2005 02:59
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: Neutrino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31602
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Yeah, I'm with you. Our showing (packed theater, with all showings that night sold out completely), the audience was laughing constantly. The movie was filled with humor.
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#266493 - 03/10/2005 05:11
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: Neutrino]
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old hand
Registered: 28/12/2001
Posts: 868
Loc: Los Angeles
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Quote:
Humorless?? Your kidding right?
What was funny? I can remember parts of the series that had me in stitches for extended periods of time. Them staring at the statue of Jayne, the first appearance of Saffron, Inara's female client, etc. The movie got little more than the occasional chuckle and smile from me. I don't recall hearing many laughs from anyone else in the theatre either. The normal banter that was a primary source of humor in the series was largely absent from the film...if they talked at all it was arguing. Halfway through the movie they didn't even really try to be funny anymore. Not that I think that was a bad decision since it would have been pretty out of place considering the massive quantity of death and darkness the film was serving us at that point, but it certainly didn't make for a fun film.
In any event, it looks like I am in the minority here. I am glad you'all liked it, even if I fail to understand how we could all like the original series and have such radically different views of the movie.
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#266494 - 03/10/2005 08:28
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: ninti]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
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Quote:
What was funny?
Some parts I remember offhand-
Mal: If you don't hear from me, you take this ship . . . and you come get me.
----
Mal: Do you want to run this ship?
Jayne: Yes
Mal: Well . . . you can't
---
Simon: My only regret is that I haven't taken the time to do what I want.
Kaylee: What, you mean sex?
Simon: Uh, yes.
Kaylee: Forget this, I'm not going to die!
---
Wash: What about the part where this is a trap?
---
-and there's plenty more, but if you have to convince someone something is funny . . .
At any rate, I remember laughing quite a bit. It was a bit more intense than the TV show, but I really enjoyed the last scenes where the team was under attack and loosing badly. It felt more desperate than most action films I've seen in a while, and that gave it an extra bit of energy. And then River doing her thing (she could kick Buffy's butt, btw) was great.
And I must admit, while I think the humor was a huge asset to the show, I don't think that's what made it for me. The humor was largely the same as Buffy and Angel, and I never really could get into those shows because the plots just failed to grip me (though I appreciated the writing). But Firefly had a great premise (basically, what if Han Solo never met Luke and the old guy) and I could identify with many aspects of the characters, who all viewed the world through different lenses. Those elements were still in the movie.
Was it different from the show? Yes. I think that's part of what you have to do when changing from the little screen to the big screen. Was it still funny and fun? I thought so. I thought many of the elements that made the TV show great were there, even if it was not quite the same.
Edited by JeffS (03/10/2005 20:29)
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-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
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#266495 - 03/10/2005 14:04
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: JeffS]
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veteran
Registered: 19/06/2000
Posts: 1495
Loc: US: CA
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s/Mel/Mal/
s/Kayle/Kaylee/
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#266496 - 03/10/2005 20:29
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: ricin]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
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Thanks, I realized both later when reading a review. "Mal", was more of a typo, but I didn't know how to spell Kaylee
_________________________
-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
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#266498 - 08/10/2005 21:03
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: schofiel]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31602
Loc: Seattle, WA
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#266499 - 10/10/2005 00:53
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: tfabris]
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stranger
Registered: 11/08/2001
Posts: 47
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Does 'goram' really literally translate to 'God Damned' in Mandarin?
Also, is just me or does the president from BattleStar Galactica, Mary Mc-Something resemble Kaylee?
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#266500 - 10/10/2005 04:10
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: Burgin]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 14/01/2002
Posts: 2858
Loc: Atlanta, GA
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Quote:
Does 'goram' really literally translate to 'God Damned' in Mandarin?
I don't think so- from what I can tell, gorram is just a made up word.
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-Jeff
Rome did not create a great empire by having meetings; they did it by killing all those who opposed them.
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#266501 - 10/10/2005 14:16
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: Burgin]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31602
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
Does 'goram' really literally translate to 'God Damned' in Mandarin?
No, I always got the impression that is was a way of showing that slang evolves over time, and that words mutate and get slurred.
Personally, I prefer it when they swear in Chinese.
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Also, is just me or does the president from BattleStar Galactica, Mary Mc-Something resemble Kaylee?
No. No one could possibly be as beautiful and as emotive as my beloved Kaylee. I won't have that kind of talk around here.
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#266504 - 15/10/2005 15:28
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: pgrzelak]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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#266506 - 15/10/2005 20:04
Re: Serenity - Discussions and Spoilers
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/12/2000
Posts: 2665
Loc: Manteca, California
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That was a hoot.
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Glenn
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