I'm having a real hard time putting this into words, and thus had a hard time searching the BBS and FAQ for it. Any info I found quickly dropped me into electrical engineer territory. So, the question:

The range of button light seems attenuated when the car's headlight's are on. ie: a Button Illumination Level of 6 with lights on is as bright as a level of 4 with lights off.

I like to keep the VFD dimmer at 80% in the day (because I can see it fine in daylight) and 90% or 100% with headlights on. I am trying to configure the button LEDs to comparable illumination levels. Though I want it brighter at night (with headlights on), this attenuation keeps even a level of MAX below what I feel matches 90% dimmer on the player.

Is this logic correct, that the buttons are brighter with the lights off? Or do I have something dyslexic'd? Thanks.

Greetings!

Buttons are brighter with the lights off. Part of the hijack patch for button illumination includes an automatic sensor - if the headlights are on (as registered by the empeg) the brightness factor of the LEDs (as measured by the hijack setting) is cut in half!!! This is not configurable from any known menu or configuration, but is hard coded into the kernel...

I have always meant to post a wish list item about making that configurable somehow...

Edit: This is the way it is supposed to behave. With the headlights on, it is assumed it is dark / night out, and you want to dim the LEDs accordingly. Unfortunately, the brightness is not controlled by the dimmer percentage mechanism through software, but via hardware, so the player and the LEDs do not share matching dimmer configurations.

That's correct - the dimming is hardcoded in the kernel, and suits most people. I suppose that shouldn't be too surprised that Firefox31 would prefer it to be otherwise - he seems to have an 'individual streak'

I wonder if we should simply scale the brightness by the current VFD dimmer value instead. This would address this issue. I'm concerned that the LED brightness wouldn't be linear though. Any thoughts?

Unfortunately, I have no better ideas. If I remember correctly, it was done this way specifically because of the way the hardware worked - that it was not linear, and the "illumination levels" actually translate to either voltages or some other signal (maybe a duty cycle?) of the LEDs.

The relevant lines of code from Hijack are as follows:

        if (headlight_sense_is_active())

                brightness = (brightness + 1) / 2;

I am willing to parameterize this if more than three people ask for it, and if a reasonable (and simple) parameter method is spec'd out.

Cheers

Greetings!

I am not quite sure what you mean by a reasonable and simple parameter method. I was just thinking something on the order of what you have already. You have "buttonled_off" parameter accepting a value of 0 -> 7 in the hijack section of config.ini. What about a "buttonled_dim" and "buttonled_bright" with the same values?

I think that most of us prefer to set buttonled_bright using the Hijack menu, so we can see what effect the change has!

So buttonled_dim could perhaps instead be a fixed offset from the bright level, eg. -2 or 0.

??

Valid point. buttonled_bright would be better on the Hijack menu. Perhaps just one value - buttonled_dim and have it be 0 or 1 for using or not using the (x+1)/2 method.

I hesitate using an offset like that. What happens if you put in a fixed offset, but change the bright value on the fly? You might run into a situation where your brightness becomes invalid.

Perhaps two Hijack menu options: one for bright, one for dim? Or, just one menu but have it detect and set based on the dimmer value.

Why have 2 settings? Couldn't you just read the bright/dim status from the empeg based on if the headlights are on/off.

Basically, when you first set your LED level in hijack (either headlights on or off), have it set both dim/bright settings, then if I toggled my headlights, the LED level would be exactly the same, unless I went into hijack again while the headlights are on, and re-adjusted the LED brightness levels. Then because the headlights are on, it would update the bright setting.

I wouldn't leave the “+ 1 / 2” code in the picture at all, because this way we could have full control over both headlight modes

bright would = headlights +12v
dim would = headlights -0v

I guess I’m asking for the exactly functionality as the default empeg screen brightness control, I guess if it is also possible, it would be neat to also be able to tie into the default brightness slider and have it also control the LED brightness levels, but that would have to also be switched on and off in hijack someplace, or at least in the config file.

Anyways, this is just my 2 cents, I’ll stop wishing now ;-)

You'll need to explain this better. I hadn't the foggiest what you were trying to describe, unless it was the way the button dimming CURRENTLY works..

-ml

The regular lights have two settings: one for the headlights being on, one for the headlights being off. Each is set the exact same way except for the state of the headlights. He's suggesting that the LEDs be set the same way. Set it once with the headlights off, then turn the headlights on and set it again.

ie using another 3 bits of flash for dimmed mode.

Thanks Bitt, that’s exactly what I intended to say. But it was almost 4am, and I was pretty tired

Sorry for confusing you mark. Hopefully this is more english, and less sleep typing

And yes, I was mainly trying to suggest not having 2 separate hijack menu items for adjusting the button brightness, but just use the same UI item to adjust different bits of flash data based on the headlight wire +12V signal.
Then I think it would be possible to remove the (level + 1 ) / 2 fragment of code, because the user would have full control over both headlight modes. Correct?

I have a better idea. If you don't want the player screen and buttons to dim when you turn on your headlights, just disconnect the dimmer wire. Problem solved.

He said:

I like to keep the VFD dimmer at 80% in the day (because I can see it fine in daylight) and 90% or 100% with headlights on. I am trying to configure the button LEDs to comparable illumination levels.

That doesn't sound like he doesn't want it to dim to me. It's, once again, an odd notion coming from FireFox, but ....

Hmm. A simple transistor inverter on the dimmer line would have the desired effect though, after the VFD dimmer levels were reset.

Just thought I'd throw another monkey wrench into the mix here...

For the past six months or so, I've had an intermittent problem regarding the dimmer. Every once in a while, when I turn on the car at night and throw on the headlights, the empeg turns on with it's display at an amazingly low level. So low in fact, that it's next to impossible to read, even in total darkness.

Luckily, there's a simple fix. Turn off the headlights, wait for a second or so for the empeg to switch back to full brightness, and then turn the headlights back on. When the headlights come back on, the empeg switches back to %50 brightness, which is how I have the dimmer set, and then all is well.

It's not the most critical bug in the world, but it's mildly annoying at times. And like I said, it doesn't happen all the time. It's actually kinda rare, maybe once every 10 times or so.

I've never really tested the conditions, so I don't know if it has something to do with me turning on the headlights at a specific time, or what.

Anyone else run into this?

FYI, this has happened with multiple versions of the 3.0 alpha software, and multiple hijacks as well. The problem may have started when I upgraded to the 3.0 branch, but I'm not positive.

Two things (A B) jump to mind. Neither seems like it is 100% your problem, but some things to test against.

It's definitly the dimmer capacitor. Unfortunatly, David isn't convering these under waranty at empeg towers any more. Anyone with surface mount soldering skills should be able to do it, especially with the video in the FAQ.

Matthew

Ack.

I was afraid it might be hardware related. Sounds like it prolly is.

Oh well... methinks it's bout time to have sombody hook me up with lighted buttons anyway...

You guys rock, thanks for all the helpful input.

So, the HiJack functionality is to be dimmer with the headlights on (at night). Thanks for clarifying. Was it designed with the following reasoning?
"Dimmer with headlights on because it's easier to see the buttons at night"
"Brighter in the day to overcome the sun light"

If that's the logic, maybe I'm just using it wrong by wanting the VFD and buttons brighter at night.

Also, in response to oliver and Bitt, HiJack DOES have two independant buttonled levels (similar to the VFD dimmer; for headlights off and headlights on), right? As far as I tested, it seemed like there were independant values for lights on and lights off. And in my tests, I varied the settings drasticaly to overcome the "half as bright with the lights on" factor. Did I come to the wrong conclusion?

But Mark, a thought about the parameter and formula for dimness. Maybe it would be as simple as:
if (headlight_sense_is_active())
brightness = (brightness + 1) / (2 / buttonled_factor);

In config.ini, buttonled_factor could be 1, 2, or 4. Essentially, it would control the amount of change in button illumination (with illumination level value constant) between headlights on and headlights off. buttonled_factor=1 would cut the brightness in half when the lights were on. buttonled_factor=2 would leave the buttons at the same brightness regardless of headlights. buttonled_factor=4 would DOUBLE the brightness when the headlights were on (if that's even possible).

Default to 1 to retain the old functionality. If people want to avoid the 50% reduction, just set it at 2.

::shrug:: Just a thought. I'll keep playing with it. Maybe dimmer at night and brigter in the day IS better.

One possibility to allow independent brightness settings without eating more flash memory bits is to allow the user to adjust the brightness from the front panel, but to only display (not store) the setting. Then you know what level to configure when you next upload config.ini.

Not as nice as remembering the setting in flash, but then, compromises are never as nice as having it all.

But... we can adjust the brightness from the front panel; both the button illumination and the VFD illumination. And it saves the settings over power cycle. And it uses different settings for headlight-on and headlight-off.

Right?

Or were you talking about the "button brightness multiplier thingey" being set from the front panel? I think I've just confused myself now. ::straightens self out:: For now, I'm wondering about the "button brighness cuts in half when the headlights are on".

I don't have illuminated buttons (yet), so I'm spouting forth from a position of ignorance. (Maybe there's a job for me in government...)

You say "it saves the settings over power cycle. And it uses different settings for headlight-on and headlight-off."

And "button brighness cuts in half when the headlights are on".

Either there are independent settings, or the headlights-on value is dependent on (namely half of) the headlights-off value. Or am I misunderstanding you?

The way it REALLY works, is, Hijack allows setting of the button illumination level from the front panel. The code there most likely assumes NON-headlamps when setting it . The result is always saved to flash.

When headlamp sense goes "Active", the dimming code (two lines of C, posted MUCH earlier in this very thread), reduces the button illumination some.

And that's how it's going to stay for now.

cheers

Ah ha, thanks for the final word clarification. Only one main setting, got it. Thanks again.

In honour of today's general availability of new translucent buttons/knobs (from FireFox31), I have released Hijack v432. New in this version is a config.ini option to override Hijack's default treatment of button-dimming when the headlights are on.

As discussed earlier in this thread, the default behaviour is to automatically dim the button illumination level whenever the headlight sense goes active. This is normal and how most of us probably expect it to work. But on a BBS full of loonies, there are always a few that want MORE CONTROL!!

So with v432, one can now specify the exact brightness level to be used whenever headlight sense is active (lights on):

[hijack]
buttonled_dim=7

Valid values range from 1 (dim) to 7 (bright), or 0 (use default behaviour).

Cheers

Excellent!!!! Thanks!

Great! Thank you Mark! I'm one of those who wants no light change when lights are on. Here we must keep lights on during the day too