I was reading a magazine and came across this expesive little gem. It got a couple of cool features but I think it still falls short. And it is $2100.00!! check it out http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/Pioneer/CDA/CarProducts/CarProductDetails/0,1429,21417,00.html

Working link.

Thanks for the fix!

Good: Built-in CD, tuner and amp. Time alignment. Auto EQ. Rudimentary front/rear/sub filters, but no bandpass for rear fill [1] Bad: Up to *six* playlists. Wow. And two user defined EQ presets. Gosh. [2] Only a maximum of 132 kbps ? Nice idea, and nice job getting it to all fit into a DIN box, but my Empeg is still much cooler. Steve [1] Doesn't bother me though as my amp has all the filters I need. [2] Having said that, I only ever use one EQ setting anyway.

I guess with 10 GB you'd only need six playlists. ;-)

-Zeke

You are forgetting the biggest pain in the ass this product causes (literally). You have to sit in the car and rip your CDs. Plus, to make it worse, it says ripping speed is real time. I would take this as meaning it will take 74 minutes to rip a full CD. No thanks.

I have to say its nice to see big label companies starting to make these things though. As much as I LOVE my empeg, I know that when my empeg finally dies, I CANT buy another one no matter how much I have to spend. That is the one thing that the big players have....they are less likely to EOL thier products, and they MASS produce, meaning in 6 months, these puppies will be going for sub $1,000.

go to good guyd, buy one return it, it will end up on the open box table next day, then buy it again for a huge discount.

Ah, but that 132kbps recording mode is ATRAC 3 (AKA minidisc format). Not sure how a comparison between between mp3/atrac bitrates works out.
OTOH, the use of ATRAC explains the "real time ripping speed". The requirement to "rip" at real-time speed was what made me give up using my minidisc. Getting music on the player was a PITA. It was like recording on a tape. Though they now have higher recording speeds on the new ones. I even went to the effort of getting an optical output sound card to try to make it easier. Still a pain.
I didn't see it mentioned on that page, but I read somewhere that you can insert a CD and let it rip even while the car is off. That would be plus.
Another thing. The built in CDDB. I wonder if you are forced to accept the info it finds for a CD - spelling errors and all. Or perhaps the database was vetted for accuracy? Ha! Not likely.
And from what I read, you can't record from a "mix CD" you've burned. Thanks to SCMS.
And the memory stick player is just that. A player. Can't transfer or record from the memory stick to the unit.

But it has a Pop-Up Rotary Volume.
Damn, I love PURV's. Where's my checkbook?

Are the big label companies converging towards the design that would have been the Riocar Mk3 ? Albiet non hardware upgradeable, non hackable etc.

I know that Sony is making one, too, as part of their Xplod line. Model MEX-1HD. ESRP $1500. Not that I'd get one. I don't like Sony.

Also, I don't know how this compares to the Pioneer version. But I would expect to see many more companies coming up with models like these.

That is the one thing that the big players have....they are less likely to EOL thier products

Do you have any idea how funny that statement sounds? Most electronics companies like Matsushita and Sony have product lifetimes which barely outlast a given holiday shopping season.

The only thing you're noticing is that there's always a whole line of CD players, or a whole line of TV's, or a whole line of DVD players, from a given company. True, but a given specific model of a specific product might only be manufactured for a couple of months until it gets replaced by the next model.

Whether or not that particular HDD-based music player gets rolled into a full product line or not remains to be seen. But that particular model will definitely be EOL'ed faster than the Empeg was.

Well let me rephrase...if its successful it will not get discontinued. True one paticular model will get EOL'd but in most cases only to be replaced by the latest and greatest version of the same thing. This will not happen with the Empeg, as they are not making an MKIII. That is what I am getting at, and maybe I didnt get that across.....please dont hurt me Tony

in most cases only to be replaced by the latest and greatest version of the same thing.

As I said, for this particular prodcut, this remains to be seen.

Actually, I'm kind of hoping it bombs because then SonicBlue will be vindicated.

Im with you on that...I wish SonicBlue could have somehow find a way to market the Empeg at a competitive price to the masses. This is a product that I think would have made it if it had enough commercial backing, although I know was very expensive to produce. Perhaps, I am wrong, maybe the Empeg is a bit too "techy" and aimed soley at the audio enthusist. Either way, I am just glad I got one when I did.

The $1200 I paid for my empeg Mk2 was a steal! The only thing it needed was more advertising... the empeg (not developed by Sonic Blue at all) was never meant to be a mass market product...

But this has been gone over a million times....

The $1200 I paid for my empeg Mk2 was a steal! The only thing it needed was more advertising...

I agree with you on both points. But if Pioneer can't market an expensive hard-disk based player, then no one can.

Of course, companies like Pioneer and Sony might choose to keep marketing certain high-end products even if they're taking a bath on them. I get the feeling that many of the more expensive products in their lines are like the opposite of loss leaders: only there to make the buying public feel good about purchasing the cheaper models. Every company needs to have a "top of the line" product just so that there's a comfortable middle ground where the bulk of the consumers can spend their money.

Of course, in the case of a hard-disk-based player like this one, it's expensive because it really needs to be expensive, not just because its speaker connectors are gold plated and it's made with a heavier casing material. So maybe this doesn't fit that category.

That's why Dodge makes the Viper!

Wow, never really thought of it this way. It does make good sense though. It would be interesting to see pioneer/sony/kenwood sales trend analysis from the last 5 years to see how thier "top of the line" products performed comparativly. For some reason, I think the Kenwood music keg will do well because even though it is new technology, it resembles a CD Changer (in the way it works) install, and consumers are comfortable with that.

This is a product that I think would have made it if it had enough commercial backing,

I think I have to respectfully disagree with you, for the reasons stated here. The empeg is the best in-car audio product ever produced, but its potential market niche is so small as to make it commercially non-viable.

tanstaafl.

from my testing.. 132k atrac3 is atleast as good as 192kbps mp3, probably more like 256.

I recently purchased a NetMD for portable use on the bus.. and recording at LP2 (2 CD's per minidisc) which is something like 92kbps.. still beats mp3 by a long shot.. still comparable to 192kbps. several other sites attest to that...

as far as hackability.. atrac is just like mp3, but the encoder/decoder are 100% proprietary.. and i have yet to see any freNIX stuff for it.. sony is such a bunch of assholes that way.

Of course, companies like Pioneer and Sony might choose to keep marketing certain high-end products even if they're taking a bath on them. I get the feeling that many of the more expensive products in their lines are like the opposite of loss leaders: only there to make the buying public feel good about purchasing the cheaper models. Every company needs to have a "top of the line" product just so that there's a comfortable middle ground where the bulk of the consumers can spend their money.

Yes, it's known as the halo effect.

I honestly don't thing this unit 'needs' to be expensive.... not long haul anyway. It's only a matter of time before the "PC on a chip" becomes powerfull enough to handle all the Empeg does an more. You'll end up running some sort of DAC + Display(Geforce92 Go) + CPU. It will cost 250 to make and will sell for 700.

I give it 3 years, assuming civilization doesn't fall down by then.

Umm, what do you think the StrongARM is? (now Xscale)

Rob

Stick to the banana sandwiches.... (Sorry, on IRC now..)

from my testing.. 132k atrac3 is atleast as good as 192kbps mp3, probably more like 256.
I suspected as much, from what I've read concerning atrac/mp3 comparison tests.

I recently purchased a NetMD for portable use on the bus..
For portable use, I opted for an Archos Jukebox 6000 for $200. Not as lite as a solid state unit, but that 6gigs is great
for variety. Plus you can use it as a portable drive. :-)

I like the fact that some of the major players in the car audio game are making units similar to my empeg. It tells me that the guys at empeg had a good idea. Good enough that Sonic Blue bought them.

Whether or not there is a market for the high dollar units is not my point here, but like everything else electronic - if it sticks around and catches on, the units will be produced with more and more features for less and less money as time goes on.

Hopefully I have many more years of life in my MKII. I cant imagine driving without it now. But when it does decide to let its smoke out, I hope the market has some of these new fancy brand name products available and I can start over.

And hopefully they'll have had the empeg Cambridge team design it!