All,

I've finally got my new Audi TT (225) - it's awesome by the way. It came fitted with a 6CD changer which I'm just about living with at the moment (but no bose sound system, i.e. No Amp).

Does anyone else have an install in an Audi TT? Where on earth did you put the amp? Is there any room behind the dash? Where does the factory fit BOSE amp go?

Also, any suggestions for a free-standing sub for the boot? I was considering putting a custom sub into the inside of the spare wheel, but I've a feeling that this will become expensive quickly.

Thanks in advance.

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

(hugo drools)

Oh well...

Hugo

Hugo,

I'm happy to give you a ride, for a reasonable discount.

Seriously though, if you guys want to take some pics for promotion purposes, that's fine with me. I'm probably going to take it to Cambs Car anyway, so I'll be down in the area anyway....

Send me a mail, and we can discuss (paul @ nailed.demon.co.uk).

Cheers,

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

Talking about installations.... what happened with that A-Class demonstrator's pics? they never made it out , nor in empeg's site nor in Cambridge's site... So anyone knows about it?

You lucky bastard!!! :) The 225 TT is one of the most awesome cars ever!! Only thing better would be a dropped top!

Calvin

That'll be the roadster version. I drove one, but I think that I'll get one for the wife (just kidding....)

It's an awesome drive, but I wasn't really tempted - especially with the 2 weeks of summer we get here in the u.k.

No, I think that I'll stick to my Climate Controlled Coupe!

I think that I'm going to have to get a digital camera now. I'll post the pics when I get'em!

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

I looked at them. Loved them from the exterior. The interior just wasn't me.
It didn't help that the 225 has a long waitlist in the US and they just started shipping. Settled for a sportbike instead.

Maybe the v 3.0 bugfix edition (third year production) ... patience. Patience.

I am VERY interested in installation details, though. What you used, why you used it, and where the heck you put it. Keep us posted...

-- Bleys

"If you would judge, understand." -- Seneca

Hi people - still here lurking, just been too busy to post for a while.

The A-Class install did make it into Car Stereo magazine (or was it InCars?) a couple of months back, but we never actually got around to getting any photos online on our website. One of my bosses has just bought a nice digital camera though, so given half the chance, it'd be nice to grab some decent pics.

Dominic


Cambridge Car Audio
http://www.cambscaraudio.co.uk

All,

I promised that I'd update you all on progress, and after a large number of emails between myself and Dominic at CambsCar it looks like we've (he) found a way forward.

Most likely the amp (a 402 kicker) will go behind the drivers seat in the panelling under where the first aid kit is (directly on the opposite side of the car from the CD Changer), failing that it'll go in the back seats (don't ask).

There is (we think) an active interface which drives the rear two speakers, so I should only need to put in a 2 channel amp, to drive the front two. I'm probably (haven't decided yet) going to go for a sub as well (a self amplified band-pass Pioneer unit), although this is a pricy option.

Most likely an upgrade to Mark 2 is coming, especially since this is the only way I can get a red faceplate, which matches the interior lighting....

Amp will come from my other car (the original Polo) and the old stereo put back - End result girlfriend gets to drive the car with just a tape player (*wince*)..........

Anyway, going to CambsCar on 3rd June - more details after the installation.

Cheers,

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

The Mark 2 would look fantastic in a TT - if you get one, any chance we could run off some photos?

Rob

Rob,

If you'd read three more posts down, you'd see that I've already offered this .

I'll send you a private message with my private email adress - drop me a line and we can discuss it.....

Cheers,

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

Hi Paul,

I'd be really interested in hearing how you fare with the install in your TT.

I have a 225Q on order, which is due to for delivery on 1st September (it's actually built, but I've delayed it until the new reg.).

I decided to order the car with the Bose Hi-Fi, but no CD changer. The original plan was to try and use the EMPEG with the Bose installed amp (which sits underneath the first aid box compartment).

I've now found out that this amp might not do the job, and that I'm probably going to have to change the speakers in the car as well (as they are all 2ohm impedance when you have the Bose option).

I am still trying to confirm a lot of this stuff, but my local Audi dealer is very reluctant to talk to me about any of it. I guess I'll have to wait until I get the car, and can do some investigation of my own.

Andy.

The original plan was to try and use the EMPEG with the Bose installed amp (which sits underneath the first aid box compartment). I've now found out that this amp might not do the job...

Have you asked Crutchfield about their special adapters which let you fit aftermarket stereos to the Bose amplifier system?

___________
Tony Fabris

Most likely the reason that the Audi dealer isn't saying anything is that they have no idea.

I did order the BOSE amp, but I eventually got a cancelled order so I ended up with the cd player and no BOSE. Feelings on the web are that the BOSE option isn't as good as you might think - do a search on http://www.audi-tt.org.

Personally I'm very happy with the sound system that came with the TT - and I'm sure that the amp/empeg combination is going to sound great!

Only a week to go......

Paul.


Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

assuming the TT has the same head unit/wiring as the S4 these links might help you out a bit.

http://www.audizone.com/info/bose/radiotag.jpg <- tag on back of head unit

http://www.audiworld.com <- more info on the bose amp is there, just need to search for it.

Okay,

I've had the empeg installed in the TT (pictures to follow) by CambsCar (Dominic and Neil).

To be honest I didn't want to hang around and watch the car undergo major surgery so I kinda left them to it, but they managed to get the amp in the same place as the BOSE amp would be, which leaves the back pocket available for the first aid kit still (woo!).

I guess that this area is suitably cooled, but I haven't checked (Dominic.?) I've done a few long drives since, and no heat problems.

The empeg looks great, although I noticed that the bass response from the empeg is significantly worse than the original concert head unit, although I think that this may be the 128kbps .mp3 files I have (I'll recode them and let you know).

Overall it's great to have the ol' boy back, and I'll definitely take a trip up to Cambs again for the mk2 install when I get one.

It took the cambscar boys all day (7hours x 2 people) to do the fit, although how much of this being down to the fact that they didn't know their way around the car I don't know. I did see a number of panels coming out from the car, so I know that the cabling goes all around the car now!

The noise level from the alternator is significantly lower than from the install in the Polo and I've only noticed *that* whine once since the install, which is [censored] fantastic.

Finally, I just wanted to publicly thank Dominic and Neil on the install, since they did a sterling job.

Dominic, anything to add, you were there after all!?

Cheers,

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

The empeg looks great, although I noticed that the bass response from the empeg is significantly worse than the original concert head unit, although I think that this may be the 128kbps .mp3 files I have (I'll recode them and let you know).

MP3 files have no problem with bass response, even at low bitrates. Re-encoding your MP3s at higher bitrates will result in better high-frequency detail with fewer high-frequency artifacts, but the low frequencies will not change.

The reason the bass response from the Empeg is different (notice I said "different", not "worse", as you did), is because the Empeg puts out a genuinely flat signal. Most car stereos, especially factory stereos, have their bass artificially increased so that even a "flat" bass setting will increase the low frequencies somewhat.

All you need to do is play with the Empeg's loudness settings and the EQ a little bit. Although I recommend leaving the loudness off and doing it all with EQ. Also, it's better to cut frequencies than boost them- so to increase the bass response, you would cut back on the mids and highs, then compensate for the lost volume by turning up the volume louder and adjusting the amplifier gain.

Now where are those pictures?

___________
Tony Fabris

"Also, it's better to cut frequencies than boost them- so to increase the bass response, you would cut back on the mids and highs, then compensate for the lost volume by turning up the volume louder and adjusting the amplifier gain."

Very well stated, Tony. And just to add my own two cents worth here, hopefully not overstating the obvious, but you are almost certainly better off with more gain from the empeg and less gain from the amplifier. Elsewhere in this bbs are formulaic instructions for setting the two gains relative to each other... but I've always taken an empirical approach to this by playing a zero-bit track (i.e, a CD of complete silence) with the head unit set to maximum gain. Then I set the amp gain to the point where I can just barely hear the system's floor noise. That seems to give optimum results.

tanstaafl.


"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"

And if you check out the .PDF document for the new Empeg Mark 2 user's manual, they give the standard procedure for adjusting your amplifier gain in there. I think it's nifty that they included it. (Have you checked out that PDF file yet, Doug? It's in the support/downloads section of the new web site.)

Of course, the standard procedure is the opposite of your procedure. You concentrate on the noise floor, whereas CW says you should be concentrating on capping the maximum volume level.

In practice, it ends up being a little of both. There is no hard and fast rule which governs where your amp gain settings should be. And although you might start with either of those procedures, you end up doing a lot of trial-and-error work and striking a balance between your EQ settings, your noise floor, and your maximum desired gain. In the end, what's important to understand is that a line-level head unit (of any kind) is designed to give good clean output all the way up to 0db, so make your adjustments with that target in mind.

Oh, and Doug, one final note: Pressing "Pause" on the Empeg (at least on my Mark 1) is the equvalent of playing a 0-bit track. It does not mute the amps when paused.

___________
Tony Fabris

Dominic, anything to add, you were there after all!?

I want an Audi TT? :-)

A bit more technical background, in case anyone else ends up with a TT to put a system into:-

To original TT system uses the A3 active system, with the front speakers powered directly off the OE unit, and an amplifier (with odd input level) on the rear speakers. We connected the RCA output onto the Empeg using a vehicle specific adaptor (Autoleads PC9404), and installed a kicker iX402 amplifier below the first aid kit in the rear 1/4 panel. There's just enough space to squeeze the amp chassis in widthways, but it's in a relatively large cavity, with good air circulation, so cooling shouldn't be too much of an issue.

With just the OE amp connected, system noise was all but non-existant. Once the 402 was connected up though, we had major interference problems - a really loud alternator whine at probably 9/10 the main system volume. To get around this, we had to tie the original amp's signal ground down to the Empeg's mounting cage, along with the Empeg's own earth. We then ran an 8AWG ground from the same point down to chassis ground in the front of the car. The 402 power ground was then run down from the back of the vehicle to the same point. This got rid of most of the noise, and we killed the last traces by grounding the 402's RCA ground cable to an earthing point in the rear 1/4.

As Paul says, the whole job was pretty labour intensive - I didn't actually spend the whole day working on the car, as there just wasn't the room for 2 of us to work on it most of the time, but it must still have taken 10hrs+. The biggest problem for us was probably the car's build quality. It's so well put together, it's really time consuming just to disassemble things - and we had to take a fair amount of trim out to run cables, etc.

I had hoped to get some decent pics of the whole process, but in the end all I got was a couple of very hastily snapped digital pictures towards the end. If I get a chance, I'll put 'em up online sometime.

If anyone does end up putting a system into an Audi with OE active system anytime, feel free to mail me - we do a lot of work on Audis anyway, so tend to have a pretty good idea what to do with them these days.

Dominic



Cambridge Car Audio
http://www.cambscaraudio.co.uk

Dominic,

Thanks for the additional information. Didn't realise that you took some pictures of my car without permission, If I was american I'd sue you.

Seriously though, I'd love to see some pictures, and I'm intending to do some of my own - watch this space.

Cheers,

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

Okay,

So perhaps "worse" was the wrong word.

I was just comparing the two systems and I do like to hear a lot of bass in my music (mostly dancey stuff). I noticed that the new install didn't have as much bass as I'm used to.

You're right that recoding the MP3's won't change, but I can notice the difference between CD and 128 fixed on thie new setup, so I'm going for the VBR from AudioCatalyst, which sounds a lot better (on the level above medium, whatever that's called).

I'll try playing around with the EQ settings, but I can't change the gain on the amp (see Dominic's post on why) so I'll have to stick to this.

I'd already boosted the 2 lowest frequencies to the max which is a bit better, but I'll go for dropping some of the others as well, and see what I get.

Failing that, I'll have to invest in a sub......

I've taken the pictures this morning, so hopefully I'll get them developed tomorrow (Thursday 8th June) and scanned in over the weekend...

Then all I've got to do is find somewhere to post them too!

Cheers,

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

Wow, thanks for the information, but as I mentioned before, I'll have to stick to the current gain settings, as done by CambsCar, since the amp is in a nightmare place.

I did play around with the gain on the previous car (VW Polo) and found that as I increased the gain on the amp, the noise level increased to an enourmous amount. Guess this kinda proves your point.

Cheers,

Paul

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

Dominic,

Isn't there a 'Cambridge Audio' too (without the 'Car' bit)?
Unless my memories are playing a game with me, I believe I bought a Quad set there y e a r s ago
Henno

Henno
ex 00120

Here are some pictures

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

Here are some pictures

I guess you tried to attach the pics to your posting, which doesn't seem to work to anybody here yet.
Can you post them somewhere else, with a link?

Or even better, would you accept e-mailed pics for posting at the geek site, Rob?


Henno
ex 00120

Here are some pictures

I guess you tried to attach the pics to your posting, which hasn't worked for anybody yet.
Can you post them somewhere else, and then provide use with a link? I bet Emma looks great in an Audi .

Or better yet, would you accept e-mailed pics for posting at the geek site, Rob?


Henno
ex 00120

You are completely correct, no attachments here. I also noticed that .JPG isn't an option either! (only png).

I've posted the pics (no HTML as yet) on http://www.nailed.demon.co.uk

They are a little small (in pixels) and I've got much bigger versions if you want them (anything up to the original scanner 12MB TIFF).

Enjoy!

Paul.

Paul Haigh, 6GB, Blue
Reg: 4120 - Serial 00254

I've posted the pics
Thanks. That Audi is indeed a beauty! Be careful though, I read somewhere that in Germany a great many of them were crashed at speeds of 180 km/h (115 mph)!

Sure you wanna stick with a blue Emma? Haven't seen it in in real life, but a red faceplate would seem to blend in with the rest of the Audi even better . . .

Henno
ex 00120

Drool....


Dragi "Bonzi" Raos
Zagreb, Croatia
#5196