so i now have at least two cd's that i can't encode, because of (i'm assuming) copy protection. these are:

prince - one night alone
and
peter gabriel - rabbit proof fence soundtrack

is there a way to a) tell if it really is copy protection that's keeping me from enjoying the music that i have paid for... and b) how to get around this protection so i can encode and enjoy this music that i have paid for.

if this has already been discussed in a previous post, i apologive in advance. please refer me to that thread. thanks!

~jason

Andy McFadden's CD recordable FAQ talks about the various protection schemes. http://www.cdrfaq.org/ . Fat chuck's maintains a list. http://www.fatchucks.com/ .

Keep in mind that just because you can't rip it, doesn't mean it's copy protected.

That's the second time I've linked cdrfaq.org only to have it be "down" when I linked it.

If you want to read the section on Copy Protection, enter www.cdrfaq.org/faq02.html into Google, and then when it comes up click on the link that says "Show Google's cache of www.cdrfaq.org/faq02.html".

> so i now have at least two cd's that i can't encode, because of (i'm assuming) copy protection. these are:

A few weeks ago I had a similar experience ( Merzhin- Adrenaline), and only thing that kept me from returning the CD is that I really wanted to have the music on my player. On the vendors site nowhere mention was made of any copy protection, or any warning on non-standard CDs.
I could not rip the music on my Linux system (programs locks up), though on Windows a special 'media player' program on the CD automatically started once the CD was inserted in de PC ... A nice solution for many users who just want to listen to the CDc on their PC. Not helpful when you are usually running a non-win environment.

> Is there a way to a) tell if it really is copy protection that's keeping me from enjoying the music that i have paid for... and b) how to get around this protection so i can encode and enjoy this music that i have paid for.

In my case, the windows program EAC did a really nice job to this Key2Audio cd, it was able to copy the CD and create the desired MP3s for the empeg..

ClonyXXL works as well. It can read a disc and tell you exactly what's protecting it, if anything. Always has for me anyways. It's free. If you have CloneCD, it works in conjunction with that too to turn on / off the right settings to copy most CD's as well.

I really don't know what I'm talking about, but I thought any music copy protection schemes were pointless because can't you record (analog) anything you can hear with a computer? As in hit play on the cd and record to WAV or directly to mp3? Even if the cd analog out is disabled somehow couldn't you take the headphone output into an aux in on a soundcard and record it? Sure it wouldn't be bit-for-bit EXACTLY the same as the CD but it would still be 44kHz 16bit stereo. Am I completely off here?

Yes, it is possible to create an analog-audio recording from any CD. However, there is significant quality loss in the process, especially if it's done clumsily or on cheap equipment.

The advantage of CD ripping is that it makes a perfect lossless digital copy of the CD, and it doesn't require skill or high quality equipment to do it well. Just the right software.

To illustrate, you could record the output of the CD as played through a couple of tin cans connected by a piece of string, and it'd still be 16-bits and 44.1kHz, but that doesn't mean it's going to sound good.

The quality of such an analog recording would depend largely on the quality of the DAC in the CD-ROM drive (probably lousy) and the quality of the ADC in the sound card (also probably lousy). Oh, and that piece of unshielded cabling wending its way through the interior of your computer.

Of course, it's still likely to be better than the tin cans and string.

Our developer here at MusicMatch who is in charge of the burner and CD-R drivers claims that "NO CD" is unrippable.

We have yet to prove him wrong. And we've given him every one we've come across.

try to use iTunes from Apple.

..but have you released his code that rips protected CD's? Our developers don't particularly want to become DMCA martyrs, how about you guys?

Rob

In reply to:

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Our developers don't particularly want to become DMCA martyrs, how about you guys?

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Oh come on, that's the main reason I'd even consider a Replay over a Tivo... Unfortunatly for you guys, I'm not in the market for a dedicated mp3 stereo component yet, but it would make it a far more attractive thing for my non-technical relatives if they could rip anything.

Matthew

Exact Audio Copy seems to deal with protected CDs - at least ones with corrupted TOCs. If the TOC looks suspect (and it does on the Cactus Data Sheild protected CDs) then pick "detect TOC manually" (or something like that, maybe "detect tracks") and it'll build a valid TOC by scooting around the CD and checking things.

Worked just fine for me when I needed to rip that Natalie Imbruglia one, though the title wasn't then found in freedb & so I had to input the track titles myself.

Hugo

Replay has no DMCA implications - it doesn't counteract a copy protection scheme. Ripping a copy protected CD is an entirely different issue, and in the case of DMCA the individual programmer can be (and WILL be) arrested on a criminal charge - even if they are not a US citizen.

This is why it is important for Philips to set precedent that CD copy protection is a break of the standard and not a valid scheme.

Rob

Can't you just record in real time from a digital output on an audio CD player?

Stu

Can't you just record in real time from a digital output on an audio CD player?

As a last resort, yes. But it wouldn't retry bad sectors like cdparanoia or EAC does.

Peter

Can't you just record in real time from a digital output on an audio CD player?

A tangent (sorry if this has been hashed in another thread...)

In a successful attempt to run Battelfield 1942, I updated a bunch of drivers, including the drivers for SB Live! Platinum. A readme/banner in the install process notified me that in future, when a Microsoft DRM-protected (forget the exact name) CD was inserted in the CDROM drive, the SB Live! digital output will be automatically turned *off*.

If this is old news -- if I have done another Rip Van Hogan -- well, chastise me!

when a Microsoft DRM-protected (forget the exact name) CD was inserted in the CDROM drive, the SB Live! digital output will be automatically turned *off*.

Well in that case just use Total Recorder to generate a WAV file and encode at will.

Stu

Ah, but they are trying to prevent that as well:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/wmform/htm/thesecureaudiopathmodel.asp

Can't you just record in real time from a digital output on an audio CD player?

Yes, assuming (1) you have a digital-output CD player, and (2) you have a digital input on your sound card. This is still more troublesome than the ripping and auto-tagging from a regular ripper program, and hence, more trouble than most consumers would go to to rip a CD.

This is discussed at www.cdrfaq.org as well, and if I recall correctly, some (not all) of the copy protection schemes take digital output into account and attempt to defeat it as well.

Keep in mind that I agree with you, I'm just playing Devil's Advocate to clarify why the record companies are trying these protection scheme. I think these schemes will backfire for all of the reasons I already cited in this thread from over two years ago.

..but have you released his code that rips protected CD's?

Actually, yes, sort of. From what I understand, he usually doesn't use more than MusicMatch Jukebox to do it. If he has problems, he'll just switch drives. I think Plextors are known to rip just about anything.

Probably an overblown reputation on the Plextors. I have a 40x10x16 that has trouble with numerous non-protected CDs -- my old 4X burner works fine.

Cheers

It has been alleged that cdparanoia will deal with such CDs, but I haven't yet come across one to try.

It seems it's not worth it to try to prevent piracy of dinosaur rock, for some reason.